[The Canadian Content]

Of The Devil's Party
Darkseid
Lucifer (DC)
William Stryker
Abomination
Morbius
Selene (Black Queen)

The Syndicate
The Kingpin
Mystique
Mac Gargan (Venom)
Wesley Gibson
Overtkill
Purple Man

[Deleted]

Syndicate

[The Canadian Content]

I'm not wild about either team. Someone convince me.

[Chris Eco]

Well, let me take one shot.



So Darkseid and Lucifer may be two powerful bad dudes, but they're both preoccupied with the same goal: take the reins of power of the universe away from the current holder, God (or One-Above-All, depending on your continuity). Separate from just 'being the devil', DC's Lucifer is an awesome character who carries with him the best of Milton's portrayal.

Rev. William Stryker is just a really awesome character who so often shows signs of potential redemption, but ends up constantly performing evil in God's name (as when he killed his wife and child out of mutant fear). The idea that he could end up so exalting his self-righteous desire for a purified, controlled world that he gives himself in the service of Satan is both tragic and absolutely perfect.

The other members fit pretty naturally:
*Abomination originally was brought back to life through the work of his world's devil (Mephisto) and owes Hell a debt. Given the choice between immortality in Darkseid's world or a return to damnation, he'll take the former. (And he's a pretty classic villain himself)
*Morbius, despite not being supernatural himself, wants nothing so much as the return of his wife--which only the Guardian of Hell can give him. Conflicted though he may be, he's the perfect tool for Lucifer as an assassin.
*Selene is a natural fit as someone who seeks validation through worship in the role of goddess. If she has to play second fiddle to the captains in the end, it's better than what her life offers her now.

Original Team Explanation:
Darkseid is an evil near-deity, dark master of the universe, and one bad dude. Returned to his natural physical form, he is looking again to regain power over the Anti-Life equation. Lucifer, having rejected "the tyrannical reign of God," has accepted a role as Darkseid's partner in this quest to remake the universe in their image--though he plans to take the Equation from Darkseid upon victory. Selene, proudly desiring the worship she was once afforded, naturally aligns herself with the team and offers her sorcery in its service.

In his eagerness to assist, Lucifer has brought help. He inherited Abomination's original contract with Mephisto for resurrection and asserts authority over his soul--Blonsky may either serve Lucifer and live forever, or reject him and receive the damnation he had earned. Morbius, reluctant though he may be, has made a deal with Lucifer--provide his expert skills in dispatching would-be heroes, and Lucifer will return his beloved wife to life. William Stryker, preacher against mutants, has been given a similar deal--preach the good news of the new god Darkseid, serve his ways, and he will have the wife and mutant-born son he killed returned to him--"cured" of all mutation, free to be together on a new "purified" Earth.

[Lucky]

I still have no idea how I feel about that team. Its a really interesting concept and its one of the teams that makes me wish I had played to do a few variations on it it makes me think of. I just can decide how I feel about it myself.

Against most other of the assassin groups constructed I'd probably give you the nod purely on curiosity but I actually really like this one character wise. Even if I think its wrong that Mac Gargan can be Venom if the traditional Venom is running around when to the best of my knowledge its the same symbiote. That might be the dealbreaker in my book.

[Ultimatejobber]

I didn't write a back story.

I don't know what I can really say to sway a vote other than I think this organized crime unit would dominate any city in which it formed. You have the great criminal mind of the Kingpin. Two pieces of muscle that follow orders as long as their sadistic urges are met and Wilson Fisk has no issue letting Gargan and Overtkill run wild from time to time. Wesley Gibson is the hitman who loves his place in life and again, Fisk will maximize Wesley's skills. The Purple Man is one of my favorite secondary villains, and combined with Mystique, will manipulate city hall to the Syndicate's will. For those who don't know Purple Man's ability allows him to command others. I felt Mystique was a great fit as a second in command as well.

[Lucky]

Besides the Venom thing my only real problem with that character/roster construction is that I question whether Mystique would be able to work with such a disgusting pile of scum like Purple Man. For those of you who don't know Purple Man is also a serial rapist and easily one of the slimiest villains I've ever seen in a comic. And I really wonder how Mystique with her sort of sense of right and wrong could bring herself to work with him without slitting his throat or fearing he'd use his powers on her.

Otherwise I really do like that team. Even if it makes my skin crawl.

[Ultimatejobber]

Dec 22, 2009 19:34:03 GMT -5 Lucky said:

Against most other of the assassin groups constructed I'd probably give you the nod purely on curiosity but I actually really like this one character wise. Even if I think its wrong that Mac Gargan can be Venom if the traditional Venom is running around when to the best of my knowledge its the same symbiote. That might be the dealbreaker in my book.

Two questions: Are people thinking of Thew Syndicate as an assassin group? Becasue that's not my intent. Its an organized crime team with one assassin as a member in Wesley Gibson.

In response to the Venom thing, I have the current Venom on my team. The symbiote Venom left Eddie Brock and chose Mac Gargan. Brock has a new symbiote and is called called Anti-Venom.

If that wasn't what you were elluding to, then I see drafting Gargan Venom like drafting one of the many green lanterns. Its just a different guy currently donning the existing symbiote. If you like Eddie Brock better, that's cool. I just didn't make Brock a huge priority.

MTA: I totally forgot my second question.

[Lucky]

I meant that the Venom symbiote should only be allowed to be drafted once. Green Lanterns don't count that way because its just a million guys with identical but different rings. But the symbiote IS Venom and he just has human hosts. So Eddie Brock can come with Venom or Mac Gargan can come with Venom but only one can in my book because otherwise it would be like drafting the same dude twice (because you literally are drafting the symbiote twice).

Another example would be Parallax. Parallax is the big yellow bug. He can possess Kyle or Hal and you can have either but you can't have Hal Parallax and Kyle Parallax because then you'd need two big yellow bugs.

I was unaware that Brock had his own different non-Venom symbiote and that puts a different spin on it. Of course that presumes that Dead drafted Brock and "Anti-Venom" and not the classic Eddie Brock Venom. But if you both have the same symbiote than that would have been a no-no in my book. Obviously Fish can run his draft how he sees fit, but I was just explaining what I ultimately might use as the tiebreaker because one of your guys feels like a cheat to me.

And sorry about grouping your team in as "assassins." I get the true nature of your team, I was just being lazy to talk about the mass of "real world criminal organizations" rather than teams bent on taking over the world or just fucking shit up.

[Ultimatejobber]

Fair enough. I guess I'm glad you weren't around to comment when I picked the guy. I wasn't trying to cheat the system or anything, and I did note that he is both the Scorpion and Venom when I picked him. When I made the roster though, I did totally use the Venom name. Worst comes to worst I could just revert him to the Scorpion character, it is just not as exciting to me as I love the new Gargan.

[The Canadian Content]

As far as the Venom thing goes, I looked at the symbiote as being more a "suit" than an entity on its own. Brock and Gargan as Venom are two completely different characters in my book. Their own personalities come through and they have different levels of control over the symbiote.

It is a shame Scorpion didn't get used though.

And after both explanations, I've gone from liking neither team to liking both. I'll need to give my vote some thought.

[Deadly]

It's too close for me. I need more convincing.

[Deleted]

I was really hoping for Kingpin to head up Foot Elite Ops (under a different name, of course) rather than Shredder. Would that have gotten me more votes? Team would've been:

Kingpin
Deathstroke
Omega Red
Silver Samurai
Lady Deathstrike
Dark Beast

[Lucky]

Kingpin by default would have gotten more interest from me than Shredder but the team still doesn't look nearly as well constructed as Kingpin's current team. Its a bunch of egomaniac killers and then a crime boss with interests in business. And his lackies are one of the world's smartest and most ambitious assassins, another crime boss with noble leanings, and a maniacal genius hell bent on genetic experimentation? Just doesn't gel for me at all.

Dec 23, 2009 9:11:25 GMT -5 The Canadian Content said:

As far as the Venom thing goes, I looked at the symbiote as being more a "suit" than an entity on its own. Brock and Gargan as Venom are two completely different characters in my book. Their own personalities come through and they have different levels of control over the symbiote.

I'm not saying Gargan-Venom and Brock-Venom aren't very different characters... but its not a suit. Its a sentient alien being that thinks, feels, communicates, and acts. The suit's hatred of Spider-man is a driving force. The suit's biological connection Carnage is a driving force. Brock and Gargan influence it probably as much as it influences them but its definitely a sentient entity.

[Deadly]

After looking at it a few more times, I'm going with The Syndicate.

[Ultimatejobber]

Dec 23, 2009 13:55:54 GMT -5 Deadly said:

After looking at it a few more times, I'm going with The Syndicate.

Dead, I take back most of the things I've said about you behind your back.

One last thing Lucky in regards to Purple Man and Mystique. I should have been more clear. I see the two of them working in the same capacity, but not together. Kingpin is a smart enough guy to recognize potential conflicts. I saw Kingpin using Purple Man's abilities to command important/influential legislators as well as an interrigator.

Mystique would definitely be more about infiltrating/replacing a member of a city council/major public official.

On the whole I'm placing a lot of faith Kingpin's ability to maintain control of his people. When I decided I wanted to create an organized crime team, the Kingpin was the only guy I wanted, because he can manage a group of egos and sadistic personalities. Plus, he's not necessarily insane himself, he's a criminal genius.