[Mr. Dashbee]

I was up late thanks to the kids, thus I saw this:

Reported here, and I'd say the company's website is fairly reliable...

Ring of Honor Announcement
Sunday, October 26, 2008

Ring of Honor is announcing that Gabe Sapolsky will be leaving the company effective immediately. Everybody at ROH would like to thank him for his contributions and wish him well in all future endeavors.

Going forward Ring of Honor will be focusing on the stories and the talent in the ring. The company will have no further comments on this issue or a replacement for Mr. Sapolsky. We would like to thank all of the fans and media who have supported us over the years and look forward to bringing you more great wrestling excitement in the future.

You all know how big of an ROH mark I am, and I must say I'm shocked. Kudos to ROH for keeping it quiet, as I haven't seen it reported anywhere before ROH announced it. They pulled that off with the PPV announcement, too. I think the middle of the night announcement isn't a bad New York Mets manager firing, it's a combination of making the announcement after their event in Edison and not letting any other websites trump the news on them. That also likely means no announcement was made to the talent out of fear that it'd get out. Hopefully they all understand that it's the nature of the business.

I've seen two reactions already: 1) people saying this is the beginning of the end for ROH (Gabe IS ROH, close up shop now, CHIKARA is the new ROH, etc.). 2) the show will still go on, the product will change a little, but the show still goes on.

For me, as I already posted on the ROH board, I think Gabe got hired by Vince, or maybe TNA. He's likely been declining offers for a while now, and finally got an offer he couldn't refuse. There is a possibility that it was creative differences between Gabe and ownership (i.e. Cary Silkin), and one of them had to go. I surely hope not. And thereis that 0% change pipe dream that it's a work, or a way for Gabe to work incognito. But I'll stick with option one, and assume he's already boarded a plane from Newark to Phoenix to be backstage at Cyber Sunday.

What's funny is that everyone assumed that after CM Punk, Samoa Joe, Homicide, Matt Sydal, Colt Cabana and others, everyone assumed Bryan Danielson was the next ROH talent to get stolen. Not the booker!

Personally, good for him. I hope he's getting paid. He might hate working for the WWE or TNA, but I'd look at it as getting paid for his almost 7 years of hard work in ROH. He deserves it.

Interesting to note that no announcement has been made, or (according to ROH) will be made about a replacement. It's long been said that Dave Prazak (commentator for ROH & IWA: Mid-South and SHIMMER booker/possible owner) would be the next in line for holding the book in ROH. The next few days should obviously be very telling. I just hope it's a move up for Gabe, and not some ugly bad break-up of a situation.

MTA:
--Interesting of note, there is a new member to the ROH message board: "ROHAdmin." They have already replaced the board rules that ROHGabe had posted with their own. Not sure if they've changed the rules at all, since I haven't read them since they were last updated, in March I think.
--Someone else pointed out that the ROH World Tag Team Champions Kevin Steen & El Generico didn't have the tag title belts on them at either show this weekend. Both of their matches were non-title, but it's weird to not carry them out. Likely unrelated to Gabe's departure, but still weird.
--FIP is the "sister promotion" to ROH in Florida. Gabe is the booker there, too. No mention of it anywhere, but I wonder what this means for them. I know they sometimes mention the promoter of the events, but you gotta wonder what Gabe's stake in FIP is/was.
--The thread related to Gabe leaving hasn't been deleted from their message board. ROH usually deletes things like that, but I'd imagine this would warrant an exception for the ROHbots.

[Byrntrigan]

That's hopefully good news for Gabe, and not bad news for ROH.

If TNA picked him up, hopefully they leave him alone and let him resuscitate the X Division.

Do you thing Greg, as a longtime ROH fan, that this will make ROH move forward and try a different booking style, stay in the Gabe style, or die? Not what you hope, but what you think.

As a fledgling fan that's really my only knock, is that his style is somewhat monotonous from the angles I've seen...

[Lucky]

Personally I'm not sure I ever saw Gabe as any kind of a booking genius. I like ROH but its selling point has always been the wrestling, not the booking. The booking has always been very simple and straightforward. There'd be a big idea/feud every now and then but either those (the CZW invasion, Age of the Fall, Generation Next) weren't exactly revolutionary. Gabe's "skill" was using classic and traditional ideas and not making them overly complicated. Not booking like Russo and not trying to be edgy like Heyman and when it came down to it doing what Vince never does and letting it be about the wrestling. Straight forward respect feuds, blood feuds, title feuds, stable feuds. Nothing fancy. To be honest ROH always kind of falls flat with me when they DO try to get fancy/edgey like with Age of the Fall and Jacobs "attacking" Lacey in some kind of silly video that I was supposed to be shocked by.

It doesn't take a genius to keep using the traditional ideas of the business and letting the wrestling do the talking. So Gabe can be replaced. The more interesting thing is if Gabe is gone because ROH wants to do something different. Considering ROH has done basically everything it can do under Gabe's style and he has balked at them taking the "next step" of TV and live PPV it might be interesting to see which way ROH goes now. But if they stay on the same business plan and keep being about hours of wrestling on each show then I really don't see a problem. To be honest I haven't been a fan of Gabe's booking the last couple of years.

As far as Gabe's future? If he's going to TNA or WWE in some capacity I don't know what to think. There's something to be said for those two companies benefiting from a minimalist approach. TNA taking out the crazy gimmick matches and Russo tweener swerve booking or WWE no longer spending all its energy trying to woo mainstream fans or media or kids and TNA/WWE just booking classic wrestling stuff... could be a positive. But at the same time Gabe has had two great luxuries as ROH booker.

1) An insanely loyal fanbase that will give you the benefit of the doubt on anything, overlook mistakes or bad shows, and get insanely excited for anything new you give them. TNA and WWE certainly have their loyal fans but its not the same and you can't count on them driving hours to see the show and buying the DVD the second it comes out.

2) A wrestling orientated live format. ROH shows can go for hours of wrestling that can make the worst booked show in the world a great show to watch. TNA and WWE are TV products and thus can't do that. Even if both RAW and Impact could certainly stand to include more wrestling on their programs they still can't half of what ROH could. Gabe tended to burn out fans on people (I think) with champions who just face a line of challengers until its finished. The same sort fo monthly booking isn't as easy and I think TNA suffered when they went to it. Back in the weekly PPV days they were a lot like ROH in that they could do wall to wall wrestling, blow you away with some new guys or long matches, and just tell a story with no real mind towards long term booking plans. The product changed when they went to monthly PPVs, cable TV, and a set roster size and I don't know how well Gabe would fare with that.

If Gabe lands anywhere it will be interesting to see and if ROH changes up that will be something to watch but I don't know. I think the biggest part of this news is potentially ROH changing their business plan and not actually Gabe himself. Gabe may very well look like a lot of other "geniuses" like Heyman, Cornette, and Russo who when taken out of their home product were exposed for not being as genius as they seemed (to varying degrees because obviously Heyman >>> Russo).

[Lucky]

I know its blasphemy to ROH fans but Gabe leaving really might have renewed my interest in the product. Because ROH had just uninteresting to me over the last year or two and I never had much faith in Gabe. And mostly I figured that as long as he was there the product would remain the same with long championship runs based on respect and telegraphed title changes and all that.

[Lucky]

www.lordsofpain.net/news/2008_/1224972651.php

Ring of Honor has begun talks of getting a national TV deal. If a deal is signed it won't be on a known network that would have them compete with WWE or TNA. This is a huge step for the promotion and would help them upgrade production of their shows.

ROH Owner Cary Silkin's said last year his goal was to strike a TV deal and have a legitimate partnership. They have spoken with Versus, G4 and Mav TV in the past but the discussions did not go past the early stages.

Credit: Wrestling Observer Newsletter

Yeah, that seems to make sense.

[Mr. Dashbee]

I've been both a defender and a critic of Gabe over the past few years. UJOB and I talk a few times per week, and ROH is always a topic of conversation. More often than not, I start criticising Gabe for being too formulaic and predictable, but I usually come around in a "In Gabe We Trust" sort of way. That's the problem with ROH fans in general, including me.

Lucky's point...

Not booking like Russo and not trying to be edgy like Heyman and when it came down to it doing what Vince never does and letting it be about the wrestling. Straight forward respect feuds, blood feuds, title feuds, stable feuds. Nothing fancy. To be honest ROH always kind of falls flat with me when they DO try to get fancy/edgey like with Age of the Fall and Jacobs "attacking" Lacey in some kind of silly video that I was supposed to be shocked by.

This is exactly spot on in my opinion.

Now, more news has been released, with one major item coming to light...
Courtesy of WrestleView, PWBTS.com, and PWInsider.com
"In followup to the story first broken on PWBTS.com, Mike Johnson of PWinsider.com confirms the news that Ring Of Honor owner Cary Silkin removed Gabe Sapolsky as booker after last night's Edison, NJ show. Johnson's story stated that "the company is going in a different direction." Sapolsky, one of the company's founders, is now no longer involved with the company in any form." PWInsider adds that there was no major blow-up, just a change in direction.

The sources are pretty reputable, so I am taking this as true for now. Given that, this lends itself to change for the future, most likely TV. Gabe never wanted to do TV, and Cary has wanted to do so for a while. PPV might have been a compromise, but I don't see how it's lead to growth in the product or company.

Gabe is great at booking a direct to DVD independent wrestling promotion. ROH and FIP are both just that. The PPVs have caused issues with continuity and delays in DVD releases. But I don't think that lead to Gabe being let go.

So if the real issue here is TV, then here is how I think it went down. Cary probably wanted Gabe to change two or three things about his booking. If I were to guess, I might go with: his willingness to get bent over by the Japanese promotions, his love for certain guys (Homicide, Briscoes, etc.) that might only appeal to a smaller audience, his overuse of certain angles, his reluctance to commit to new talent. I could see a few others coming into play like: Gabe's hate for having an on-screen authority figure, his reluctance to have a repeat world champion, and his propensity to "pull the trigger" too late on certain people (Kevin Steen & El Generico and Tyler Black being recent examples).

My ideal TV deal with ROH would follow the Versus model with the WEC. Have a monthly show with new matches, whether they be from a double shot or from a single show. Actually, I'd like to see ROH start to tour in threes: Friday, Saturday & Sunday, once a month. Then, your monthly Versus show could come from these shows. Throw in an hour long weekly show like WEC Wrekcage where old matches are shown, peppered with a few current storyline updates, and I think you have a TV show that can work for ROH in the short term (1-2 years). If the company grows from that point, then you can move into live (or live to tape) weekly TV and monthly or bimonthly PPV.

To answer Byrne's question:
I don't think death is an option here. Rather I think Cary might have seen that on the horizon and knows they need to grow. I think there will be changes, but Cary, from everything I've read/heard, believes in the fundamental aspect of ROH, the in-ring product, and telling stories in the ring. I don't think that will change. I think the changes will be minor (new authority figure gimmick, less international stars getting monster pushes, more title changes, possibly less reliance on outside promotions' titles). And I really think the changes are geared toward TV. Prior to this report, I think the big report on Friday was that they were once again in early talks for a TV deal. I think it's safe, for now, to think that Cary saw their major obstacles as being Gabe related. In the end, I think it evolves into a very different, yet still in-ring oriented product; one that appeals to a broader base of fans but still entertains the current fan-base.

When Gabe was at his best, he was phenomenal. Making Samoa Joe a 22-month long champion, the surprise Austin Aries title win over Joe, the Summer of Punk, the CZW feud and Bryan Danielson's title reign really stick out for me. I'm sure I'm leaving some out. But when it was bad, it was bad: Faction Warfare, Larry Sweeney/Bobby Dempsey/Allison Danger ill advised rape simulation, etc.

Regardless of whoever takes over the booking, there will be changes. I'm sure a few talents that don't fit the new booker's ideals will go. There might be some moves up & down the card. Some new talent will be added. Maybe some with personality. Prince Nana, coincidentally, returned to ROH this weekend. And I love me some Nana. I also think that we've seen the last of TNA wrestlers in ROH. If you're looking at TV, you are now a competitor.

And there are yet more issues to be looked at. Bryan Danielson's contract is up in May 2009. Most assume he's gone, but most also assume he's getting another title run. Gabe was criticized for giving James Gibson a token title run after he signed back with the WWE. Was Gabe preparing to do that again? ROH let BJ Whitmer and Jimmy Rave out of contracts in the past, do they look at the same with current talent? (Not Danielson specifically, but talent in general.) There is also the video production, which is okay at best. I'd imagine by early 2009, Jaison Moore and PowerSlam Promotions will be replaced by a larger, more professional outfit. What of the commentary? Dave Prazak & Lenny Leonard don't exactly get the best reviews. If DP does take over the booking, I'd imagine he's out of the booth (I'd bet Cary wants live commentary at some point, especially for TV). Do you go with Leonard and someone with, you know, personality?

Yet another issue is the website. Gabe was the source for the Newswires and the majority of the content that was put up. And he was a big supported of the message board, even though he bitched about it. There was even a time where he e-mailed someone who posted on the board, telling them to "fuck off" because they said he wasn't a hard working booker. Gabe confirmed this when he apologized for it. I'm sure Cary wasn't happy about that one.

One more issue is "new old" talent. What if Colt Cabana gets released? AJ Styles' TNA contract runs out? Samoa Joe's? CM Punk's? These guys loved ROH, but went as far as they could with ROH. With the old ROH. ROH on TV might be a different deal altogether.

So, where do we go from here? I don't have a crystal ball, but here's what I'll predict for October 2009:
1. The WWE is still #1, and the product will be slightly better.
2. TNA is still #2, and some of the things that Kurt Angle complained about will be better.
3. ROH is on TV, drawing okay ratings. Someone will defect to ROH, and be a large focus. Danielson will be gone to the WWE, maybe Nigel as well.
4. FIP will be positioned as the new ROH, with Gabe as the booker. They will be using TNA talent, and expanding out of Florida, likely into the northeast.

[Mr. Dashbee]

I read some new news about the situation...I'm not sure if it changes things or not.

Bill Behrens is reporting that Cary Silkin nearly shut down ROH altogether after last month's Philly show. From what I hear, Philly drew 1000 fans in the New Alhambra Arena, which is cheaper to run than the Philadelphia National Guard Armory (which is a nicer facility). He reports that other members of management convinced him to keep it open (Gabe included), and that the non-Gabe members of ROH convinced him that it was time to let Gabe go.

So while it drew well, they brought in Kensuke Sasaki and Nakajima for the show, which wasn't cheap. They probably still lost money on the deal with this one. Normally, it gets made up with DVD sales, but with a down economy, less people are buying them (as evidenced by the sales they've been having).

Behrens is somewhat out of touch, though, as he is stating that ROH needs to scale back the shows and focus on DVD sales. It does seem like that they are more focused on TV than ever, which directly contradicts what Behrens said.

He did confirm that Gabe was totally against PPV, but went along with it, and Gabe was totally against ROH on TV.

[Mr. Dashbee]

Lucky, the news of the TV deal came out before the news of Gabe being gone. Regardless, you're right in that it does make total sense.

It's almost comical to read the ROH board right now. They are picking apart ROH's statement, especially when they mention focusing on stories and wrestlers. They think it means a total change in the product. I think they are saying we are focusing on the stories and wrestlers right now and not focusing on Gabe's departure. It's a wrestling company, not a Gabe company.

MTA: I also read that ROH will be booked by committee. No idea who's on said committee, but you need to go through Cary to do so. He wants to make sure your philosophy is in line with where they are headed. Obviously, Gabe Sapolsky's wasn't.

[Lucky]

I have to take a trip to the ROH boards. I'm sure my head will hurt but I have to check it out.

I am surprised to hear that ROH was so close to shutting down. I kind of had the impression that things weren't going great. I knew those shows had been canceled and that the PPVs had been basically non-factors that got bad buys and seemed to annoy the DVD buyers by delaying releases and screwing with them. And in general it seemed like the ROHbots that so often seem to cover up for ROH during down times and with bad attendances or shows were either working double time or didn't seem to have their hearts in it themselves. The sane diehards I know seemed to be down on things for awhile and it seems like the latest crop of wrestlers brought in from CZW, Chikara, etc were getting mixed reviews. But still, I didn't think things were going poorly enough to make them consider closing up shop.

I do agree with your basic TV idea (I think, I've never seen WEC so I don't know the example). I was basically just thinking the old ECW Hardcore TV format. Keep the touring schedule with the DVD sales. Air some matches on TV but keep the full things on DVDs. Enough to get people interested and enticed but also a good enough product to make people want to pay attention. I think ROH has 2 real problems. (1) There's NO way to get new fans unless the existing fans drag them in, and (2) the Video Wires don't quite do the job of keeping casual fans like myself involved with the stories and interested in the characters. TV can help do that and it doesn't have to be a big RAW/Impact product. UFC has done a pretty good job feeding potential fans like me enough stuff to get my interested for the real product. If they can get any kind of syndication deal where they're not paying for air time I'd think that's a good thing. Especially since its not 1996. Let ROH air at 2 AM on G4. I'll DVR it. That situation HAS to be better than back when ECW had it.

All in all ROH has felt stagnate for a long time. Seems like it became the undisputed king of the indies and was something special back during Joe's run/the CZW feud/Danielson's run. It was exciting just to read about and it seemed like something was happening. But it never went anywhere, it just stayed the same product and inevitably the peak ended and the product was basically inferior. I've just always been kind of amazed that they don't even improve their production values because those are really some shitty productions. It always amazes me to see people get on TNA's levels (which are admittedly below WWE's) when the next thing is ROH which kind of looks worse than ECW did 10 years ago.

Get some decent announcers, get some kids out of college who are masters at production (hell, hire me, I can do better than ROH does), put together some nice sample episodes of your product for TV, and start to showcase personalities. You can still have kickass wrestling shows, still have a lucrative DVD service because you can't show all that awesomeness on TV even if you wanted to. But open doors for new fans and people like me who WANT to care and help the company without having to follow on the ROH board and HAVE to buy DVDs sight unseen to watch.

Gabe was the guy who had problems with Low Ki, right? Could Gabe leaving mean Low Ki returning? Because ROH on TV with Low Ki and Briscoes would make me very happy. I'll go running around Yonkers bars looking for Eddie Kingston to beg him to get his shit together and join up too.

[DevSop]

I'd be worried about the Briscoes more than anyone right now with regards to ECW. A lot of rumors had been circulating that the only reason TNA allowed LAX to replace the Guns this weekend was because they wanted to see the LAX/Briscoes match as sort of a try-out for them. And if it was, they passed with flying colors. The match was awesome.

Yes Gabe has the issue with Low-Ki and I believe a few others.

Low-Ki will be back.

[Mr. Dashbee]

I think we'll see some talent changes in general over the next few shows. I'd imagine this can even effect a big name or two (I wouldn't be shocked to see someone like Larry Sweeney gone now that Prince Nana is back). I expect to see a ready for TV roster & product by early 2009, regardless of an actual TV show being in place.

The latest news type things I've read in regards to this story:
--Bushwacker Luke Williams seems to be involved with the booking, either solely or as part of the committee. He's a good friend of Cary Silkin. I know nothing of his booking philisophy, but I understand he booked in Puerto Rico for a while.
--Apparently, no one saw it coming. Not the talent, not Gabe, not anyone. I have a hard time believing that Cary didn't at least ask Gabe to change some things before outright firing him. I'd imagine he talked to him, at minimum, after Glory By Honor in Philaelphia, since he nearly shut down. A month later, and it was the same old Gabe, so Gabe had to go.

As for items such as Low-Ki...I think he'll be back sooner rather than later. He'd inject some life into the product, which it needs. I also don't think we'll see a World Title change on the 11/22 PPV taping or at Final Battle, as both are very predictable. Interesting to note that Tyler Black cut a promo in Edison calling for change in ROH, and saying he would be that change by winning the World Title. Probably just more coincidence, but strange coincidence indeed. I think guys like Kenny Omega and more Chikara guys wll continue to find work in ROH as they get tryouts. Kenny King had just been signed full time, and it was likely that Cheech & Cloudy and/or The Osirian Portal would get signed, too. The core group shouldn't change much, but you could see a 40-50% change in the overall roster by 2009.

I have a friend who wrote a song in college titled "Change is Good & Attitude is Everything." That kind of sums up the whole thing for me. Gabe Sapolsky suffered from tunnel vision in terms of the product, but the end of the tunnel represented the same thing at the beginning, an independent wrestling promotion that runs 2-4 shows per month and releases DVDs. A promotion that compromises booking and it's own ideals to make Japanese promotions happy. A promotion that books TNA talent and treats them as special attractions. A promotion that features other promotions titles as a substitute for their own secondary belts.

For ROH to grow in Cary Silkin's vision of the company, TNA wrestlers can't be special attractions. They can't be on the card at all anymore. Japanese promotions can have talent appear, but ROH books them to fit in with the long term plans to benefit ROH, and no one else. FIP, Shimmer, NWA, GHC, Dragon Gate, and whose ever else titles can't exist on in ROH. And, apparently, Gabe Sapolsky can't book the promotion anymore. Because they can't just be happy with 6 1/2 years of success, they need to evolve and elevate towards another 6 1/2.

Good thing is, the fun has really just begun, hasn't it?

[DevSop]

So Gabe leaves and they want to move away from using TNA guys as a special attraction or whatever and the first big announcement today.

Samoa Joe is coming in for the Chicago show on 11/22.

Color me befuddled.

[Mr. Dashbee]

Credit: PWInsider.com

- ROH owner Cary Silkin made the decision to let Gabe Sapolsky go as booker. Sapolsky was told at the ROH show in Edison over the weekend and was said to have been shocked. Things did end on good terms between the two sides. One of the reasons Silkin let Sapolsky go is because the company now thinks that to grow, it will need to focus more on the entertainment side of things and less on the wrestling side. Silkin wants a new direction and feels like the promotion isn't hitting on all cylinders right now. Sapolsky also drove people crazy with his fits from time to time.

The two bolded statements from this report (ripped from 411mania, who ripped it from PWInsider) are what will concern me going forward.

1. Focus on entertainment and less on wrestling? I'm all for making it more entertaining, but the wrestling is what sets ROH apart. Their guys get stolen because they can wrestle. I am starting to get a little concerned with just how big of a change in direction we're going to see.

2. The comment about Gabe "driving people crazy." I was waiting for this to happen. Gabe was largely considered one of the best bookers in the country, winning the Wrestling Observer Best Booker Award 4 years running. Now we get to hear everyone complain about Gabe. Who he liked, who he didn't like, playing favorites, backstage demeanor, etc. I'm sure it's the nature of the beast--but it still sucks since the guy has been largely praised for so long.

[Outback Frito Pendejo]

If you guys only know of Luke as a Bushwacker, don't panic. The Sheepherders were a legendarily brutal team before they became a WWF comedy act. I don't know anything about his booking, but don't assume he's going to bring in garbageman and plumber characters.

[Mr. Dashbee]

I don't know much about Luke's booking in Puerto Rico, but they're not exactly known for wrestling plumbers. I think the booking will be okay.

Samoa Joe is coming back for one night, likely to dark match main event the PPV taping. I guess they want the place packed & rocking for PPV. There goes my theory about no more TNA wrestlers! I guess the note about using more old stars could mean these types of appearances to increase attendence. I think trading a few mid-carders for a Samoa Joe or AJ Styles will do more harm than good. A 9 match show with 3 matches involving students & local talent or a 7 match show with Samoa Joe back in ROH? I'll take the latter.

And I already like the mini-articles on the website more than before.

I remain optimistic.

[Mr. Dashbee]

Ok, more news.

PWInsider is reporting that Adam Pearce was hired as the new booker for ROH.

Well...remember the show a month ago in Philadelphia, the one where ROH nearly shut down? That was Adam Pearce's last booking with ROH. At the time, it was reported that Pearce was well aware that it would be his last event, and all parties left on great terms. Many thought it was because Pearce lives in San Diego, and was a fly-in. In a strange coincidence, Pearce lost the NWA World Heavyweight Title over the weekend. I also heard a rumor locally that Pearce was moving to the East Coast, but that's totally unconfirmed.

Let's look at this objectively:
1. One month ago Adam Pearce works his last ROH date, due to financial reasons, which would be a Cary Silkin decision.
2. Saturday night, Gabe Sapolsky is removed as the booker.
3. Also on Saturday night, Adam Pearce loses the NWA World Heavyweight Title in Mexico (although in controversial fashion).
4. Sunday, Adam Pearce sends out an e-mail to the ROH workers & staff introducing himself as the new booker.

Obviously, there was a plan in place for at least a month. Gabe was kept in the dark, but in reality, that needed to be done. I'm sure he's getting some sort of pay for this (two weeks at minimum, maybe more like 6 weeks?), because that's the right thing to do. Now, if there was a plan in place, or talks had happened, then ROH is really, really good at keeping things quiet. Also evidenced by them keeping Joe's appearance quiet.

Also of note, their message board is down. It may be due to record traffic, or they shut it down (be it temporarily or permanently). The local promotion I work with here shut theirs down a few months ago, because it became a place to complain. People bitched for a week, then it became a non issue.

In regards to Pearce...I am even more optomistic. He seems to have a great mind for the business, and cuts awesome old school promos. I have no idea if he'll wrestle or be an on-camera authority figure. I'd like him as the latter, only wrestling when necessary. I've been lucky enough to meet him, I actually shared a locker room with him once. He was a really nice person, told me that he thought I did a great job as an announcer, and we talked shop for a little.

I don't think Pearce will book himself to win the title or anything, but I do expect him to eventually become an evil authority figure. I'm okay with that, because he'd be great at it, and it will get some faces over in the process.

I think some good stuff is on the horizon.

[DevSop]

I will be fine with ROH if Tyler Black wins the title before the year ends.

[Mr. Dashbee]

I do think Black is a future world champion, but my personal choice is Roderick Strong first.

I know Pearce is pretty old school, and I'd expect his booking to follow suit. While I don't see match quality suffering, I also don't expect to see heel Tyler Black feuding with heel Nigel McGuinness, regardless of the promo Black just cut on Saturday.

It will be a really interesting experiment to watch Gabe's last show and Pearce's first show, and see the immediate changes. Follow up that viewing with the first 2009 show and see the total transformation.

MTA: One bit of small news, apparently Pearce's e-mail to ROH talent stated he'd be wrestling as well as booking. Obvious potential for conflict of interest, but Pearce could also use himself to seriously elevate some faces. I'll reserve judgment on him being the player/coach until I see it pan out.

[Mr. Dashbee]

Well, it seems like this is turning into a long line of documentation. I'm reprinting this here, it's an e-mail rportedly sent to the DOI site by a current member of the ROH roster. Now, the DOI site is notorious for thei rirresponsible reporting, so take it with a grain of salt.

Note: anything with ????? is filtered out by the ROH board. It's usually a reference to RF Video & the original owners.

Source: DOI

DOI Note: The following was set to us by a current ROH wrestler who wanted to remain anonymous but wanted his points out there.

All good things come to a end. ROH was created in 2002 and we know all the history of the company. Rob ????? had a dream and put his heart and soul into the company. Along with Doug ???? and Gabe Sapolsky they created something speical. They knew their niche and started their own brand of strong style in the states that resembled New Japan pro wrestling's jr division with a blend of All Japan wrestling and a added twist of ECW.

In the last 24 hours ROH looks doomed. There has been so many behind the scene problems in the last 6 months that its own booker went looking to work for the WWE and that was not by choice. I know Gabe very well and he has always been outspoken on his problems with the office staff who just did not understand the wrestling business. He was given the keys to the car, but often told me that Cary always wanted him to drive the wrong highways. Gabe was not a easy person to get along with. He was a very paranoid person from day one in the company. In IL there were many fights in hotels between the office staff that if any of the other boys would have heard we would have all been looking for work else where. I always remained with the company knowing my spot.

Two months ago I told Gabe that he is going to be cut in due time. The writing was all over the wall. I was hearing all types of negative comments from Syd and Ross and there were many secret meetings in towns with Adam. I also knew that Cary was getting more involved and really breaking Gabe's balls by always questioning him. Just last week there was a major blow up which at this time does not matter.

What matters is Gabe was fired with no warning what so ever. I was backstage and I knew it was coming on Saturday when I saw Cary storm off into Syd's work area. Then the time bomb went off just hours later. Gabe was so in shock that when he was leaving I was scared to even go up to him. In less than 24 hours later the company has a new booker who I might remind you is a worker just like me.

Now this is not 1986 and Adam is not Dusty Rhodes but this is never going to work. ROH is a indy company and nobody in that locker room is going to take orders from another wrestler that has no track record. Why will the boys listen to Adam? What has he done in wrestling other than run a small company in CA. Do you know how many egos are in the ROH locker room. Do you know how many guys think they could now book the company? Adam sent a email out to the entire staff yesterday and asked us to Kfabe he was the booker. I almost spit my water out of my mouth. This thing is doomed to fail. You can't be a booker and than book yourself into the top heel spot. Like I said if this was a Terry Funk or a Dusty Rhodes things would be smooth sailing but Adam can't just come into our locker room and take over the ship. He is just a indy worker, who is a great old time heel. But that heat will never work in ROH.

I re-read his email and how he is going to change the style of the company and to be quite honest I know alot of the boys are not happy about this and we are not happy that Cary stabbed Gabe in the back. Gabe is no angel by any means but now there is a pattern here. I know that after the ????? incident that he was led to beleive he would be brought back. Cary and ????? met over and over again as ????? had a plan and a investor that was going to relieve Cary as the front man but let him remain owning the majority of the company. They were about to get a TV deal as well. Cary along with Syd Eick thought they could make more money without ????? by forcing him to sell ROH so they can do a version of RF VIDEO and combine it with ROH as they did early on with their straight shooting series. That system failed miserabally. Cary than promised Doug ???? a spot for life later to turn on him because he remained loyal to RF VIDEO. Now Gabe after giving 6 years of hard work to the company they just stab him in the back. This man lived and breathed ROH and brought Cary to where he is at now. Yes he might be broke but without Gabe there is no ROH.

As a wrestler, how can you trust ROH? I mentioned ?????, ???? & Sapolsky. Thes are the three men that built Ring of Honor. These are three men who put their livelihoods on the line for ROH. And now? All have been stabbed in the back & fired from Ring of Honor. The wrestling business will eat you up.

I don't know where I stand right now with ROH, but any wrestler is expendable. I am happy that a straight person is booker rather than Luke though. If we had a gay booker it would fuel sites like DOI and message boards because of Cary's orientation. I don't think Pearce is the right guy in the end.

I read Bob Magee's column about ROH and how you can compare this to Vince buying ECW where it's called ROH, but it really isn't ROH. The jury is still out on that and Bob does come off like this is the end of the world but I do agree that the ROH letters are about to go under a major transformation.

The company is going to go under after a few short months. I would have rathered see Cary be honest with his locker room because now we never know what to expect. Nobody trusts anyone after this week because we all thought we were a family. This is no disrespect to Adam, but brother your just one of us. You are throwing your career away on this one. This will hurt you with TNA & WWE. I hope NWA pays your bills because ROH sure won't. I know many of us feel betrayed and I hope that after this weekend some of us learns the true definition of honor.

To Gabe, I know you hate this site but no other site would print this. It was an honor to work for you and shake your hand. The code of honor still lives inside of the ones who believed.

Umm, yeah. If this is legit...wow. This will be fun to watch develop.

[Lucky]

Nigel loses the belt to Strong, Strong loses the belt to Black, Black loses the belt to Adam Pearce who holds it for 2 months. MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

I don't understand why all the ROH fans are freaking out over the TV deal news. They're all making the argument that its the same mistake Heyman made. Which is fine in theory, assuming they're trying to make the leap Heyman made to TNN. Right now ROH isn't what ECW was in syndication and THAT seems like a more reasonable goal. TNA had Xplosion and FSN before they had Impact on Spike. Why does "ROH want a TV deal" equal "ROH is going to waste a ton of money on production, put out a shitty product with a nothing roster, have a network unwilling to work with them because they're just using them to lure a bigger fish, and an incompetent financial setup"?

I mean, even IF ROH was looking for a big deal ala ECW on TNN they'd still need to make a deal with a network using them to try to lure in TNA or WWE to make the comparison equal. And they'd need to have moronic accounting skills when they're currently seemingly well run and in the black. Not to mention they'd have to have as bad a roster as ECW had and as inferior a product.

I mean, TNA gets mocked by all these same people as the worst wrestling in history. They're constantly mocked on these sites by these fans for failing to draw higher than a 1.1 and having bad buyrates. Yet they're in the black at the moment. Sure, it took years and support from Panda to get there but ROH is working from a more stable place and presumably isn't looking to make the same kind of leaps. I doubt ROH is thinking of live PPV and the level of production values that TNA has.

It just seems silly to me that ROH fans are freaking out that ROH is going to shoot itself in the foot looking for TV when a modest boost in production, a bunch of film students working for modest fees, and 2 AM time slot on Versus would give them a whole new outlet that they've never had. Would ticket and DVD sales jump enough to warrant those added costs? I don't know. But its not a huge move and it IS the natural one to make for ROH.

ROH fans just seem sore that their little DVD indy has FINALLY decided that catering to the same bunch of rabid smarks isn't good enough. And somehow that them trying to get on TV isn't about them trying to find the "lost wrestling audience." Its them trying to get ANY of the TNA/WWE audience that they currently don't have because those fans don't even know ROH exists.

WSX drew ratings that plenty of networks would be happy on in a late night slot with MUCH better production values and more expensive names than ROH reasonably needs to get some attention.

[Byrntrigan]

So, Bushwhacker Luke and the owner Cary are gay?

I dont give a shit, but that seems odd for the "worker" to make that point. Also, something about this seems worky to me.

It's just stuff that seems to convienent (ie. "We are focusing on our guys - no TNA guys anymore", and "Joe is ROH in Chicago") seems weird.

Where's Gabe on these developments? Even fucking Heyman talked after being fired. And from what I've read of Gabe, he's a big talker about stuff.

This seems either like a good angle, or a desperate owner being fed bad intel.

To have an active wrestler the same age as the other guys booking now? At least when fucking Sullivan and Nash did it they were older and respected.

Something seems smelly in ROH-town...

[DevSop]

DOI is garbage and according to them everyone in ROH is gay and Feinstein never solicited sex with a minor. It's a piece of shit website and I'm willing to bet that email is 98% fabricated by the shitbags at DOI.

I don't think it's too weird to let Pearce book since a lot of guys have supposedly been involved in if not completely booking their own stuff. Supposedly the AotF stuff has been all Jacobs and Black. Pearce supposedly booked the Hangm3n Three stuff. Hero could possibly be involved in the SnS stuff.

Pearce may wind up being head booker in name and final say, but it could just be an inmates running the asylum thing as well.

[Byrntrigan]

Ahhh, gotcha. I've never heard of this website, so thanks for the heads up.

Sounds like old ECW. But with them, they had a lead guy who pointed the company and had the high points.

I guess at this point, it's wait and see. Lucky makes a good point, if they are looking to try and do a WSX, that is doable and very possible for them.

Anything different then what they've been doing will wrankle the faitful, but look what TNA has been able to accomplish in the same time frame.

I hope if it's apparent that Pearce isnt working that a lead, respected person is brought in. Why not bring a Vampiro, or a Quakenbush in.

[Mr. Dashbee]

I purposely mentioned DOI's reputation and advised to take the e-mail with a grain of salt. But, stuff like that is usually rooted in some element of truth, even if only at a rate of 2%. After re-reading the "e-mail," I'm skeptical as to it's validity as well. But I'd bet some of the backstage stuff is true.

Pearce does have booking experience with AWS in California. I have no idea how that went, though. For him to succeed in ROH, he has to be stern backstage, and selfless in the ring. If he starts out in Montreal, I could see him showing up as Kenny Omega's partner against the Briscoes, possibly turning and starting a feud with Omega that quickly cements him in ROH. Getting (& putting) the new guy over could go a long way for Pearce's reputation in the back, and Omega is a guy everyone seems high on.

I don't know if anyone like Vampiro or Quackenbush would have been a better idea. Vamp has been up & down in Mexico, and Quack IS Chikara (possibly more than Gabe WAS ROH). Maybe someone retired/semi-retired like "Reckless Youth" Tom Carter could have worked, I'm not sure. Possibly Jerry Lynn, but I suspect that avenue was explored. I'm sure others were as well, including Luke Williams. Pearce was chosen for a reason, and hopefully we see it work out.

The ROH board really cracks me up right now, too. It's a total mix of gloom & & doom and stubborn optimism. One thing I hope Pearce does is completely ignore that board. Gabe got too involved with their board at times. It still only represents a small percentage of their fanbase, and a mildly annoying one at that.

Dev -- any proof on wrestlers being involved with their booking? I always suspected just the opposite, that it was all Gabe. But you're more connected to ROH than I am, so you'd know better. I'm all for people providing input, but for Pearce to have any credibility, it needs to be all him--at least for the first few months. I have a feeling he has a lot of people he'll need to win over.

I'm really looking forward to next weekend's shows, just to see if there are any immediate differences. The shows could be carbon copies of a Gabe booked show and their message board will still be able to list a hundred changes they all observed.

[DevSop]

I know either Mike Johnson or Meltzer have said in the past that Jacobs was completely responsible for the Age of the Fall booking stories and that Black was 100% behind their website and what not.

Hero was just an assumption since he has such a reputation for "knowing the business" and his stories have been pretty confined for the most part.

Supposedly Pearce's bookings in AWS went really well but that was also a company that ran at most once or twice a month so this is a completely new thing for him. As I told my friend who I go to all the shows with, I don't care about any of this stuff as long as the in-ring product (matches and stories) entertain me. ROH has done that 80% of the time. As long as that doesn't change, I don't care what direction the company goes.